Embracing Advocacy: Mary Buffington’s Mission to Improve Maternal Healthcare

Transcript

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Hello, today I have with me Mary Buckington, msn RN.

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Mary is a nurse, a presenter, an advocate and a coach.

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She has worked as a nurse since 2006 and worked in oncology, end of life home health and psychiatric nursing.

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In 2018, she began working as a coach and served frontline nurses during the COVID-19 pandemic.

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After experiencing a traumatic birth in 2021, she launched Arrow and Key Wellness, a wellness company dedicated to helping people reclaim and redefine their physical, mental and spiritual health in a way that honors their individuality.

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She believes better health comes when we honor the individual and their unique journey.

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Mary currently offers coaching, energy work and wellness classes, both virtually and in Shepherdstown, west Virginia.

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Connect with Mary on Instagram at arrow and key wellness or by email arrowandkeyllccom.

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Mary.

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Welcome and thank you so much for joining me.

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Thank you so much for having me.

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I'm so glad to be here.

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So today we're going to focus on your birth journey.

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At some point we're going to go back and focus on your expertise in the birthing process and what you have to offer with all of your background.

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But today I want to know the origin, the where that passion came from and how you've channeled the experiences that you had during your birth into helping others.

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Sure, I have been a nurse since oh my goodness, 2006.

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So I have some years underneath my belt and I actually worked in OB when I was in nursing school as a tech, and so I was around birth prior to my actual birth.

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I mean, I was there with a lot of my friends who are in their births, but I was there working and taking care of patients when they were getting birth and afterwards, before they went home.

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So birth was not something that I was so scared of because I had some familiarity with it.

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However, it was someone that started my whole entire birth journey really late in life.

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I met my husband in my 30s and then we got married around when I was 33.

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And I wanted to have a kid, but I was having some issues with fertility.

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I was someone that didn't need to get some help.

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I tried to do an acupuncture and all the natural things, my first little bit through.

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However, none of that worked.

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So I started talking to different reproductive endocrinologists and I tell you it took me a couple of times to find the right fit and I eventually found one that you know.

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He was amazing, very supportive.

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He approached me and not as I needed IVF, he actually looked for ways to work with what my body needed and so I had to do some injections of I can't remember I think it was FSH.

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I can't remember what the name of the medication.

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If I get it wrong, I am sorry, but I did that.

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So I had to do injections.

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We tried naturally the first time and then we used IUI the second time and we're successful in getting pregnant and my pregnancy was pretty uneventful by the like, the grandest scheme of things.

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I mean, my first trimester was miserable.

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I didn't want to eat anything.

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Everything smelled horrible.

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I about killed my husband when he decided to cook a steak in a frying pan like that.

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No one should do that, I tell you to a pregnant woman.

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It was awful and I still don't even like steak to this day because of it.

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But I had dealt with that.

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I dealt with some carpal tunnel in my hands, but beyond that, like I was okay, I was getting around, I was still coaching, and that's when I was doing primarily for income at that point in my life and in a pretty good place.

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About 32 weeks we went in for one of the ultrasounds because I was one of the AMA women.

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I was over 30.

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I was 35 when I was pregnant and they were, so they watch you a little closer and you're a little bit older.

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They make you feel like your enemies are, like you know, ancient, like by saying geriatric pregnancy they got to work on that language.

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I think they are by the historical.

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I just call them the golden girls.

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They had Blanche and Sophia, but any who.

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What ended up happening was they went in there and I was a full breach.

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So my baby was up.

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His head was up underneath my liver.

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I thought it was this like feet kicking me because it really hurt.

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But no, that was his head and his feet were pointing down.

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We did decide to go through ECV, I believe at 35 or 37 weeks, I forget when it was.

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We did have a successful flip.

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My kid was the right way down.

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We did decide to go ahead and move forward, however, with a scheduled induction, because I am a big researcher as a nurse, I went through PubMed and found research that women that are over the age 35 do have better outcomes if they have their baby before.

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They don't go over 40 weeks and they usually go at the 39.

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So I made that decision to go ahead and move forward with that and went through about an 80 hour induction where we literally tried everything.

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I went through all the processes of TOSEN and the little string thing they put on there against your I don't know what it's called.

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It's like this little piece of paper.

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They put it against your cervix.

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We tried the site of tech servidil Servidil, thank you.

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I was like the thing it's like a string and you can't really you gotta be careful about moving with it.

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And then we did the site.

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We also tried side tech pills and honestly I didn't have epidural or anything at first with it and the contractions never really bothered me.

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I remember feeling like, oh, it just feels like something's squeezing inside, and my husband's like, yeah, that's a contraction, you're the nurse, honey.

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And I'm like, yeah, but I mean like there's a level that, even though it was sort of this, I think my biggest complaint up to that point was really that the bed was hard and there was, I mean, like the setup there.

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They did not have the wireless monitors and what they had they were like scrubbing my belly with like almost a sandpaper thing to try to get it in here and it just wasn't working.

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So I was like basically stuck to the bed a lot during my induction and that bed was flipping hard because they're like, when I was like, can you flip the mattress?

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And they're like, no, we can't, because if you start having to go into labor then we have to flip it back, which I just think it's lazy.

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But that's my two cents.

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What do I know as a nurse?

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Because I've been a lazy nurse.

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I will own that.

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But either way, that's where we were and I guess things really started to just go sort of down like what was Friday evening, and we were when the pitocin drip in my son started having D cells, which basically means his heart rate dropped during the contractions with the pitocin and that was a sign that he was in distress.

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So the decision was made like they let him settle out, and then the decision was made, hey, we should probably just go with the C section, like it was a merchant.

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But it wasn't like, oh my gosh, your baby's going to die, it's like if we don't go the second.

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So it was like, all right, we're prepping, we're going, and it's like one o'clock in the morning we get back there to the, to the OR, and they, after they, shaved you up and everything like that could you?

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You know that little mallet downstairs is what I called it.

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It was not.

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I tell you it's something.

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But get back there and they put you.

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You're in T shape.

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If you're not familiar with the C section, your arms get strapped up because they don't want you to grab them and move in.

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So you know, like they're doing a surgery, they need things to stay still and you are awake during that surgery usually and they utilize the epidural that you have in your back to get medication, sort of control pain.

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Well, I remember telling the guy that the my anesthesiologist that was there in the room like I want to make sure I get serfram because I hear people get really nauseous and I would look cute, a little cute for my first picture of my baby, and he wouldn't even look at me.

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He was just like doing a say I'm like hello, hello, and then I heard the timeout start and I'm like what the fuck?

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Like that's basically like the pain starts and I'm like he's not listening to me and I see him go sit down by the computer, starting to chart on Epic and my husband, sitting is, comes in and he's there and the drapes up there and then basically they started going in, started.

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I started feeling things happening.

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Now I didn't really feel like the initial cuts or anything like that, but as they start going deeper I started feeling everything.

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It wasn't pressure, it was tearing.

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It's not only described to people like I could feel things moving and I saw in that scene the other side of the curtain of a C-section.

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Like if you're not been on the other side of that C-section curtain, it's a little bit like they're pulling their mimic things around, so they're making one cut one way and then they're pulling the abdominals all the way to get down.

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There's a lot of layers to get to the actual uterus and get to where the baby is.

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And I was basically feeling everything and it was tearing and I was clenching my hands, I was trying to breathe, I was biting my lips and finally I just started screaming.

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And I look back and I'm seeing my anesthesiologist sitting by his computer about three, four feet away from me.

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He was not interacting with me at all and I actually I don't remember everything.

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I screamed at that point but I remember like screaming, I'm going to die, you're going to kill me and I was basically that level, screaming frantically through that birth.

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I remember being so relieved hearing my son's first cry, like that's it.

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And it wasn't because I knew my son was okay, but because I knew that it was over, that he was out.

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They were great that there was no more that they would do.

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And at that point I started.

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He went up and he started putting more stuff in my IV.

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I think he put Adavan and some other medicine in and then at that point they actually started medicating me and I remember going to I didn't get to see my son right away.

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They took him over there to like check him out with the neonatologist and then they came.

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I did get to see him for a second and then they took me way through the post-op area for recovery and in that space we basically I mean like I was feeling better because they gave me Adavan, they gave me fentanyl, they gave me dimmerol to help me stop him with the shakes that were happening from the pitocin, and I was actually I was feeling good, I was chatting with Kathy, I was good and I got to see my son.

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It was good at that moment and there's a level that you know I was like my son's okay, we're okay, we're here, and so I don't know if it was a medications I don't know that I saw my son or if it was some of the stuff I've done on my own mindset work, that work.

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But I was okay at that moment.

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And then we got back to the room and I got, you know, actually got to hold my son for the first time at that point and it was beautiful like getting to hold him and see his face and be like I made.

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I made this creature.

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I was just like this beautiful Bonnie moment.

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And after my pain started creeping up at that point and I put on my call bell for Tylenol because I didn't want to do a lot of opioids.

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That was my big goal with my personal birth land.

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I wanted to avoid as much opioids as possible and stay on Tylenol and ibuprofen just to keep my pain under control.

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And I rang once and they were like okay.

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And the second time it was about 15 minutes later.

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I'm like okay, like I'm really worried my pain is going to start getting bad.

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I put on the light again and I'm like I'm really need my Tylenol and the nurse came in that was taking care of me.

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She basically told me I needed to calm down and that surgery.

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I should expect surgery to hurt was two of the things I remember of that conversation and I remember getting angry because I was coming in as a registered nurse.

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I worked with surgeons for forming some of the most complicated abdominal surgeries, like whipples and you know, taking the bowel out, which is not that much different than a C-section, and cutting into an hemocleactobies remembering parts of the bowel for cancer patients and so I was pretty well versed and I've been in the rooms with them, those surgeries.

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Having someone say that to me.

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I was like, yeah, I know it hurts, I've taken care of whipples, I've taken care of that, that's why I need my meds.

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And she gave me it and she sort of disappeared.

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And then another nurse came on for the morning shift.

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I think they did a dual report, but I cannot remember that piece.

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But there was almost like this condescending attitude with that nurse about, like what I was doing, a pain management.

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No one had asked me how I was doing at that point and it wasn't until a surgeon came in at 12 o'clock and said, hey, how are you?

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How was everything?

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She was the first one to ask me that and I just broke down crying and say like I thought everything.

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I just want to go home, I don't want to be here anymore, because I was so frustrated I was.

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I have never been treated like this by a nurse before and no, mind you, this was my first admission to a hospital but I've never been treated like this by a nurse before and I expected to receive better care than what I went through I expected.

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You know I did.

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I didn't like say like hey, I'm a nurse, or pull like the nurse card really hard, but I mean like people, I was first said, yeah, nurse, and I coach nurses and so you know I try to be cordial with my team taking care of me.

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But it was almost like at that point I was a burden and I did something bad.

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It wasn't until that doctor came in.

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It was like, are you okay?

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That surgeon asked me that simple question that things change, and she listened to me.

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I basically told her everything that happened, everything from the birth experience, what happened with the nurse.

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I just wanted to go home, I wanted to go get out of there and she was like you know, I am so sorry this happened, that's not something that would happen in my OR.

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And that's where everything changed for me and I realized that it was not safe for me to be someone that was just trying to be a patient, that I needed to basically be a nurse and I something clicked and I just went back into my nurse navigator mode that I normally did and I was just like at that point now no longer the new mom.

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That took away that whole entire experience for me and I spoke to her further about it and she basically had the head of anesthesia come in to talk to me about what happened.

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I had so many different people in that room and the nursing care dramatically improves.

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My nurse I had that evening she listened to me actually received good quality care that night.

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It was the first time on it.

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It was one of the few times that I stayed at my care, basically stayed consistently good through the end of it.

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And you know it was sort of fun because I tell you what the anesthesiologist like he was trying to of course protect, cover his butt and protect his person.

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I was like you know, I'm sorry, I've been in enough rooms in ORs so that is not normal and if this is happening to your family, members like you would have an issue with it and this is not okay.

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You need to address this with your staff.

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Like I went, I was basically not very I was a very pleasant at that point.

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So we ended up sort of getting to a good place and we got out of there about two days after I had my son.

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We got home and my milk was having issues coming in and that was something I had planned to do was breastfeed my son, and they were saying, you know, it should come in at some point and honestly, never really did it Probably has to do with some of my fertility issues, but I then had to basically deal with the fact that my son needed to be put on formula and I had a lot of story and thoughts around that and you know, it just felt like I'd be a day, I don't know, like I had been hit by a whole entire train with the birth piece of it.

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Now I had some personal family things that were also really hard happened shortly afterwards.

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Then I'm not going to share this podcast, but it was basically like I didn't get a break and it was just.

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I didn't really have space just to process what was happening for me and I was just trying to get through, to get through and take care of my son and take care of what was happening with a family member and, honestly, just struggling to keep things together.

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When we went to our postpartum follow-ups at six weeks which I have some strong opinions about I did that whole entire checkoff thing and there was nothing that really was meeting, really addressed, where I was, like it sort of says, where you feel glued, you feel like the world's on top of you.

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I was able to check off like two things, but it wasn't showing me as having postpartum depression.

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However, I was having issues with put with intrusive thoughts that were coming in, like reliving what happened in the surgery room, reliving what happened with the nurse afterwards and trying to figure out what I could have done better.

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How can I fix this?

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And I realized that these were signs from my other my psych experience, that I was having signs of PTSD.

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So I sought out a therapist immediately and started working with a therapist and seeing somebody weekly.

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This made a huge impact when we worked on some coping strategies to help me manage some of the symptoms, because they were happening before I was going to bed.

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I mean I started listening to certain music and doing certain exercises and helping reset my nervous system and just sort of getting through that whole entire feeling that what I should have done differently.

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Now, overall, through this process, eventually I got to a better place.

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It's been a long journey to get here, but it was honestly one of the hardest things I went through and my traumatic birth was not due to anything I did.

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I refused to take any blame of it.

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My birth was the fault of poor care and the healthcare system and most of this was due to the fact that they didn't care that there was a customer focus or patient-centric focus.

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It was almost like I was dispensable at that point and they were just going through processes and I do think that there was a level of burnout and that is a big reality in healthcare right now and at that time, and also we were dealing with COVID and I have very strong opinions.

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What we did to women throughout COVID, and mothers during COVID especially, is criminal, like taking away their support system in one of the most scary and vulnerable times of their lives.

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Women until recently died in childbirth like 20% of women died in childbirth less than a century ago, and now women can go through that, but then they're left to clean up the mess.

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We don't have good support system for women after birth to really sort of navigate any of the challenges they face.

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And I know I'm not alone.

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I actually joined Facebook groups.

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There was a traumatic Facebook group and I honestly have a lot of respect for the admin for that group because she ran a really tight ship, like would let people do sales, would not let people that were therapists or anything like try to do any work or studies in that way, and she basically gave a place for people to process their birth experience.

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However, I was in a group that was on a traumatic birth group and I said like this is my experience with my alone and there were so many women that said, oh my gosh, I thought that was just me, like I felt everything.

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They would share things.

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Like every time it's my kid's birthday, I cry because you know, I just think about what happened to me and I tell you that's something I do appreciate now that we're two years out.

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There's always a moment, like the evening before, where things just hurt.

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There's this pain and the interesting thing is, I think a lot of people look at traumatic births and they always want you just to get over it.

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They want you to be like well, you're okay, not at least you have a healthy baby, but you can't ignore that trauma that happened.

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And I'm someone that has chosen to share my trauma because I don't think what women go through is fair.

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I don't think it's ethical.

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There's no reason at this point that anybody should be going through a birth experience and be completely left that shattered from it or left that broken or left it worse than what they came in.

00:18:31.068 --> 00:18:40.488
And that's a big part of why I changed my practice from just focusing on nurses, because a part of my work when I was working as a nurse was an advocacy as a navigator.

00:18:40.488 --> 00:19:00.726
So when this sort of crap happened to my patients, I basically knew where to go and I was able to give them those resources, and I actually have done that for a couple of my friends and sort of gave them those recommendations as well about what they should do, what they should ask for and not being afraid to speak up, because the reality is, in the United States, a lot of people do not see a birth until they're actually having their own child.

00:19:00.726 --> 00:19:02.130
It's not common.

00:19:02.130 --> 00:19:09.250
Most people, when they're giving birth, they either have their mom around, their husband around, or their partner and then themselves.

00:19:09.250 --> 00:19:14.846
You're not usually seeing like a bunch of women, like what used to happen back in the day when someone was giving birth.

00:19:15.280 --> 00:19:26.846
And I mean that's what my hope is with Aaron Key is to be able to tell people bad things do happen and bad things can happen to you in healthcare, but that doesn't mean it has to be a permanent thing.

00:19:26.846 --> 00:19:34.684
You know, looking back, there's one person that I'll always have a lot of gratitude towards and it was a surgeon that asked was the first person to ask me how are you doing?

00:19:34.684 --> 00:19:36.023
How did everything go?

00:19:36.023 --> 00:19:50.188
Those questions might not seem like they matter, but if you look at research on PTSD, the sooner someone's able to process what happened to them, the less likely they have long-term challenges and problems related to their PTSD.

00:19:50.188 --> 00:19:51.904
She validated me.

00:19:51.904 --> 00:19:55.446
She didn't basically try to explain things way like the head of anesthesiology did.

00:19:55.446 --> 00:19:58.347
She basically is like I'm sorry that happened to you.

00:19:58.769 --> 00:20:07.046
And one thing, because I called back and tapped to the patient advocate, which, if I could give one advice for anyone, you always have a patient advocate in every hospital's requirements.

00:20:07.046 --> 00:20:11.864
You can always reach out to them and they are there to basically get in touch with someone to get to help.

00:20:11.864 --> 00:20:14.505
If you're having bad care, they'll talk to a manager.

00:20:14.505 --> 00:20:16.691
They'll even go up as far as they need to the CEO.

00:20:16.691 --> 00:20:22.207
Now my problems were dealt with, but I did have the CEO come visit me on a Sunday, my last day before I got discharged.

00:20:22.207 --> 00:20:33.766
So you know, just saying that, or was it Monday, it was like the July 5th, it was like right around the July 4th holiday, but he showed up but at that point the care had been improved.

00:20:33.766 --> 00:20:35.506
I'm like I think we're in a good place now.

00:20:35.640 --> 00:20:51.150
But when I did call back, they did let me know that the surgeon sent any anesthesiologist for peer review and professional conduct for my experience through the C-section and that really meant a lot to me and I will always respect that surgeon till this day.

00:20:51.150 --> 00:20:55.124
And if someone wants to go back to the hospital I'd be like go to her because I know that she'll take good care.

00:20:55.124 --> 00:20:57.544
And the surgeon that did my surgery, he did a beautiful job.

00:20:57.544 --> 00:21:03.065
I have like no scar, like I have the most beautiful C-section ever imaginable, like you could barely see it.

00:21:03.065 --> 00:21:13.328
But afterwards, you know he just sort of played off and said things like well, that's their role and you know I don't really get involved with anesthesia, but that is a concern, anything to hear from a provider.

00:21:13.819 --> 00:21:19.346
They should be able to talk to members of a care team and a colleague and say, hey, you need to do something.

00:21:19.346 --> 00:21:20.570
They could have shoot my husband.

00:21:20.570 --> 00:21:24.166
I'll be like, listen, we need to put her under and we're gonna put you out here for right now.

00:21:24.166 --> 00:21:25.044
They could have done that.

00:21:25.044 --> 00:21:32.710
They could have used nitrous oxide, they could have had other things available and resources to basically deal with what I was dealing with.

00:21:32.710 --> 00:21:33.351
I mean like shit.

00:21:33.351 --> 00:21:36.284
I mean they could have even put a leather strap in the fucking cart.

00:21:36.284 --> 00:21:38.585
I wouldn't have cared, I would have bit down on a leather strap.

00:21:39.039 --> 00:21:45.709
But I mean, like just leading someone to basically suffer through something, not communicating to them, is not acceptable in this day and age.

00:21:45.709 --> 00:21:58.989
We are more informed consumers and I'll be honest, like I'm a medically savvy person and if I'm going into having this experience, I know that this is happening to other women in that hospital that may have barriers such as a language barrier.

00:21:58.989 --> 00:22:01.709
They might be a lower income, lower education levels.

00:22:01.709 --> 00:22:03.527
I have a master's degree in nursing.

00:22:03.527 --> 00:22:09.326
I've been a nurse for a long time, so this is why we need to start speaking up about this and why I'm speaking out about it?

00:22:09.326 --> 00:22:22.306
Because there's no reason that any of this should happen to women, and I think my experience how the providers were not listening is why women die afterwards because they don't know that they can basically raise a ruckus, and I think it's time we raise a ruckus.

00:22:22.559 --> 00:22:23.565
Yeah, absolutely.

00:22:23.565 --> 00:22:25.185
That's why I'm trying to raise a ruckus.

00:22:26.462 --> 00:22:41.203
So you kind of answered this question that none of the surgical team acknowledged your screaming no it was like the only person that actually acknowledged my screaming was my husband and, in all fairness, we don't think about secondary trauma, but that is a real thing.

00:22:41.203 --> 00:22:45.844
That happens Like he basically watched me screaming through a C-section and there's nothing he could do.

00:22:45.844 --> 00:22:49.204
I'm the medical one in the family, like he does computer stuff.

00:22:49.204 --> 00:23:00.029
He's great with computers, but when it comes to medical stuff I manage everything because I'm the nurse, and that's a very common thing that happens to nursing family members, unfortunately.

00:23:00.400 --> 00:23:03.868
Yeah, did you get an epidural before your C-section?

00:23:03.868 --> 00:23:04.852
Were you at that point?

00:23:04.980 --> 00:23:07.226
I did, I did actually.

00:23:07.461 --> 00:23:08.231
First they called the C-section.

00:23:10.183 --> 00:23:13.987
No, I think they would have done a block if they would have done, or whatever that's called, where they just go in and out.

00:23:13.987 --> 00:23:15.590
I had the catheter in.

00:23:15.590 --> 00:23:16.660
They were giving me something.

00:23:16.660 --> 00:23:17.740
I don't know what they were giving me.

00:23:17.740 --> 00:23:18.683
I should know these things.

00:23:18.683 --> 00:23:19.866
But something.

00:23:19.906 --> 00:23:21.664
because I was, I mean that was why.

00:23:21.664 --> 00:23:23.666
Because I mean I just didn't know if they had access.

00:23:24.519 --> 00:23:25.303
Oh no, they had.

00:23:25.303 --> 00:23:38.701
So I had an epidural place Because, remember, I did an 80-hour induction, which was Ugh, I mean like hindsight 2020, I didn't really say this earlier when I was talking, but my kid has cord wrapped around his neck twice.

00:23:38.701 --> 00:23:42.222
There was no way homeboy was coming down like he was not descending at all.

00:23:42.222 --> 00:23:51.842
But I got the epidural before they did a balloon, the balloon thing, and they were doing the balloon and pitocin and I mean it was great because overall I did the only thing.

00:23:51.842 --> 00:23:56.403
I felt things at the top of my ribs, but overall I was like I was fine, I was like whatever.

00:23:56.875 --> 00:24:03.222
I think the most annoying part was actually the having the fully catheter during that time period and having to be stuck on my back and bed.

00:24:03.222 --> 00:24:05.268
It was all apparatus.

00:24:05.268 --> 00:24:12.842
There's like this metal thing I don't know how to describe it, but I can only describe it like when we're doing radiation to someone, like for their prostate cancer.

00:24:12.842 --> 00:24:21.339
I couldn't see it now, mind you, I had a belly in the way and I was also one in epidural, but there's a level that I could not move the balloon that we usually use.

00:24:21.821 --> 00:24:22.324
There's a couple.

00:24:22.324 --> 00:24:37.826
You can either use a foley bulb which is just like on a you know it's a foley bulb with varying sizes or you can use what's called a cook's catheter, which has a balloon on one side and then a balloon on the other, and they put one balloon inside the uterus and then the other one is on the outside of the cervix.

00:24:37.826 --> 00:24:44.298
They create kind of like pressure on the cervix and help those prostaglandids be created to help soften the cervix.

00:24:44.298 --> 00:24:47.615
Some providers will put them on traction, so it's possible.

00:24:47.635 --> 00:24:50.625
They're on some sort of traction, and maybe that's the metal device.

00:24:51.394 --> 00:24:52.137
That could be the case.

00:24:52.755 --> 00:24:55.703
Some just attach it to the stat lock to get a little bit of traction.

00:24:55.703 --> 00:25:00.105
Some will actually attach it to like a bag of LR to have actual weight on it.

00:25:00.105 --> 00:25:01.721
Typically I don't have patients on my back.

00:25:03.118 --> 00:25:04.644
I was on my back with the balloon.

00:25:04.644 --> 00:25:08.340
You know there's regrets I have and I want to be closer to my family.

00:25:08.340 --> 00:25:12.645
I picked a hospital because they did nitrous oxide, because I wanted alternative pain relief.

00:25:12.645 --> 00:25:13.917
I really don't want to do an epidural.

00:25:13.917 --> 00:25:16.023
When I was planning before my baby flipped breach.

00:25:17.035 --> 00:25:18.160
But I did all my research.

00:25:18.160 --> 00:25:31.384
I did the things that you're supposed to do and I was not doing anything like out of left field, like these are normal things to look for when you are going for like surgery or you're looking for a procedure, you're going to look at okay, what is the person's outcomes?

00:25:31.384 --> 00:25:33.741
What do they offer to help to manage pain?

00:25:33.741 --> 00:25:34.596
These are good questions.

00:25:34.596 --> 00:25:41.864
As to your surgeon before any surgery, and the fact that people get guilted if they're having a baby blows my mind a little bit Like no, you should just throw your birth plan out the window.

00:25:41.864 --> 00:25:44.364
I don't think it was asking for anything out of left field.

00:25:44.364 --> 00:25:45.758
I basically wanted to.

00:25:45.758 --> 00:25:51.662
You know, as a MacV, I tried flipping, we tried doing all this stuff and I was willing to try it.

00:25:51.662 --> 00:25:56.981
But you know, like hindsight 2020, I should have just been like, no, we're done with this, let's just go ahead and get to a C-section.

00:25:57.275 --> 00:26:01.025
But I got a lot of fear around a C-section and because it was surgery.

00:26:01.025 --> 00:26:03.382
Understandably, nobody wants to have surgery if they don't have to.

00:26:03.382 --> 00:26:13.020
But you know, my C-section was most flip and traumatic but I wanted to, first of all, had it with the doctor that I really liked, that I know would have advocated for me.

00:26:13.020 --> 00:26:15.144
I don't know man.

00:26:15.144 --> 00:26:17.288
Yeah, here's the thing you don't know what you don't know.

00:26:17.288 --> 00:26:25.240
I mean, even though there is a lot of resources and information out there's, some of it is not helpful and I mean like I was trying to navigate that.

00:26:25.342 --> 00:26:26.826
But COVID really changed things.

00:26:26.826 --> 00:26:30.400
I could only have one percent of room at my time and I actually had a dual love.

00:26:30.400 --> 00:26:33.662
She can't be there for a C-section, and that was back in July of 2021.

00:26:33.662 --> 00:26:54.643
They started opening up things a little bit more so I could have two people in the room at the same time, but before that they had to retain it out and so it was just like if I had to do it over, I probably would have just gone with like straight for the C-section because I like that surgeon, and then been like maybe forward with it and I hate to say that and I don't want to discourage you on to get an ECB and stuff like that.

00:26:54.643 --> 00:26:56.721
But my kid had his cord wrapped around his neck twice.

00:26:56.721 --> 00:26:58.560
His cord was really stretched then.

00:26:58.560 --> 00:27:07.141
I'm very fortunate that we did not try to go through birth because that could have been really flipping, dangerous, like a vaginal birth with him, because I mean like it was really stretched then.

00:27:07.342 --> 00:27:10.134
Yeah, and that's not something we can see either.

00:27:10.134 --> 00:27:15.121
There's no way for us to know what exactly is going on in there with the cord, so it's possible that it wouldn't have mattered.

00:27:15.121 --> 00:27:16.941
I'm surprised the ECB even worked.

00:27:16.941 --> 00:27:18.861
We keep referring to it as the ECB.

00:27:18.861 --> 00:27:25.561
That means external cephalic version, which just is a fancy way to say that we're trying to flip the baby from breach to head down.

00:27:25.561 --> 00:27:30.645
But if the cords are up around his neck two times sometimes, that's the reason that he's breached.

00:27:30.645 --> 00:27:34.262
So I'm shocked that that it was even successful.

00:27:34.604 --> 00:27:35.226
You know it's crazy.

00:27:35.226 --> 00:27:37.602
So my husband and I, we had our cords around our neck.

00:27:37.602 --> 00:27:38.163
Both of us did.

00:27:38.163 --> 00:27:39.821
I think mine was once, his was once.

00:27:39.821 --> 00:27:41.559
I mean we're both poor, sick babies.

00:27:41.559 --> 00:27:46.502
Because of that it's a weird saying, I don't know because they were worried about getting out.

00:27:46.563 --> 00:27:49.221
Yeah, One of my cord was around my neck so I wasn't coming.

00:27:49.221 --> 00:27:52.759
I was stuck and so they had used the four steps I guess help get me out.

00:27:52.759 --> 00:27:55.862
I don't know, like his mom had to do something for him.

00:27:55.862 --> 00:27:57.298
Now my husband has a big head.

00:27:57.298 --> 00:27:58.221
That's another thing.

00:27:58.221 --> 00:28:00.103
I mean like knowing how big my kid's head was.

00:28:00.103 --> 00:28:06.279
I honest it was like a hundred friends since I was like, oh my God, I don't want that, I don't need that in my life.

00:28:06.279 --> 00:28:12.265
So I guess I got spared that Like there's a level that I do use dark keyword to sort of cope with things and yeah.

00:28:13.696 --> 00:28:15.301
It's how I cope with my trauma.

00:28:15.301 --> 00:28:15.863
Thank you.

00:28:15.863 --> 00:28:19.063
You know there's moments I do get emotional thinking about what happened.

00:28:19.063 --> 00:28:29.127
But yeah, like it was, yeah, it was just sort of one of those things where, like man, that should have been a sign of too much, but had our cords around our neck and then our kid had it trapped twice.

00:28:30.250 --> 00:28:35.684
But he like I mean to be fair the same thing happened to my kids and I was able to have a vaginal delivery.

00:28:35.684 --> 00:28:38.059
So it really just depends on the type of cord.

00:28:38.059 --> 00:28:40.257
Yeah, I mean like big juicy cord.

00:28:40.257 --> 00:28:41.199
That is it.

00:28:41.199 --> 00:28:42.080
Long did it?

00:28:42.080 --> 00:28:43.845
Is it loosely wrapped, is it?

00:28:43.924 --> 00:28:44.085
tight.

00:28:44.526 --> 00:28:45.228
It all depends.

00:28:45.228 --> 00:28:53.565
I've seen sometimes it makes no difference if it's a big juicy cord and if it's a really thin cord and it's a tight cord, then it's likely to make a big difference.

00:28:53.565 --> 00:28:56.560
There's I mean just literally every birth is so different.

00:28:56.820 --> 00:28:58.786
Yeah, my sense was pretty thin, I mean.

00:28:59.734 --> 00:29:02.503
I'm not saying you're right or wrong for for not proceeding with the C section.

00:29:02.503 --> 00:29:04.660
It's there's so many variables in childbirth.

00:29:04.720 --> 00:29:05.963
Right, Absolutely.

00:29:05.963 --> 00:29:07.599
I've talked about it before.

00:29:07.599 --> 00:29:13.346
We have to look at the reality that there's 600 years worth of damage that's been done towards women in the birth space.

00:29:13.736 --> 00:29:15.521
Since the beginning of humankind.

00:29:15.521 --> 00:29:19.483
Yeah, birth is traumatic and we have not done much to help that.

00:29:20.115 --> 00:29:21.178
As a true statement.

00:29:21.178 --> 00:29:29.659
Honestly, a lot of the fixes I don't think are big, dramatic, like we need to change a whole flip and hospital system to fix as simple as maybe considering.

00:29:29.659 --> 00:29:51.522
Maybe we need to have someone that is just solely an advocate for people that are giving birth, like when a mother is in their labor, you know, like she's talking to someone before, like there's any issues, you call me and that person is basically checking on the math towards because most of our mortality rates I think are postpartum these days in the United States and where they'll go home and then they have a complication.

00:29:51.522 --> 00:30:03.001
Having a nurse, navigator or someone that is trained to sort of ask the right questions or go over something could make it could basically change that conversation or even, you know, like actually having trauma informed providers.

00:30:03.202 --> 00:30:04.486
Yes, I was about to say that.

00:30:04.875 --> 00:30:09.405
And there's a lot of women that have sexual trauma going in and giving birth as one of them.

00:30:09.405 --> 00:30:27.066
So I mean I've dealt with most of my stuff but out of like, you give up a lot of your control when you're in the birth space and the hospitals, which is why I think women look for home births because they want to have control over what's happening to them and not to feel like guilted if they want to do something a little bit different, absolutely.

00:30:27.795 --> 00:30:29.240
You are fully aware of the state of healthcare.

00:30:29.259 --> 00:30:29.461
Yeah.

00:30:30.355 --> 00:30:32.839
Like with the staffing shortages, and not just staffing shortages.

00:30:32.839 --> 00:30:34.262
It's not something that just happened.

00:30:34.262 --> 00:30:35.144
It got made.

00:30:35.144 --> 00:30:36.606
Exactly that's what I'm trying to say.

00:30:36.606 --> 00:30:38.390
It got made because it's money.

00:30:38.390 --> 00:30:42.884
It's purposefully short staffing under the guise of utilizing resources.

00:30:43.465 --> 00:30:44.027
I love that.

00:30:44.434 --> 00:30:45.820
Like stewards of our resources.

00:30:45.820 --> 00:30:49.259
Right, oh my gosh, that's a whole entire another podcast.

00:30:49.259 --> 00:30:51.865
Right, it is totally and this is why it's happened.

00:30:52.434 --> 00:31:02.406
And when you say things like if somebody could call and follow up on these mothers, I hear in my head hospital administration saying, oh, but we do.

00:31:02.406 --> 00:31:03.857
We have the nurses call.

00:31:03.857 --> 00:31:05.743
Okay, let's talk about that.

00:31:05.743 --> 00:31:12.387
Most of the time it's the nurses calling during some lull in taking care of actual patients.

00:31:12.387 --> 00:31:16.846
They're not trauma informed in a way that they are certified.

00:31:16.846 --> 00:31:20.105
We have dozens of hours of online training that we have to do.

00:31:20.105 --> 00:31:22.682
Most of it is not in a meaningful way.

00:31:22.682 --> 00:31:31.942
It's just a bunch of lists of crap that they want us to memorize and then overly dramatic videos about how to deescalate, and it's the same video every year.

00:31:31.942 --> 00:31:41.698
It's not anything where we're actually going through a meaningful trauma informed program where we would have the and also we're traumatized.

00:31:42.118 --> 00:31:42.598
Yes, you know.

00:31:42.598 --> 00:31:46.349
So we're on the clock, we're under the gun.

00:31:46.349 --> 00:32:04.190
They're trying to make us have these conversations and I'm not the one doing the calls right now, because, I mean, it used to be a thing when I was in postpartum but they want us to do it under a certain amount of time, under all of this pressure, and you can't focus on your patient, on their emotions, on their, on anything you can't.

00:32:04.190 --> 00:32:16.474
It's not being done Well, and so if a human being that is Sully focused on that, we're given the tools that they needed to actually follow up with these people, and the tools were good.

00:32:18.361 --> 00:32:20.665
Not just that are you feeling weepy?

00:32:20.665 --> 00:32:39.344
You know, like if we actually focused on perinatal mental health disorders, perinatal mood and anxiety disorders, not just depression, as it fits into this little category of what we Consider to be female hysteria after birth, right, or depression.

00:32:39.344 --> 00:32:40.006
I'm sad.

00:32:40.006 --> 00:32:40.769
Yeah, that's not.

00:32:40.769 --> 00:32:41.751
That's not the reality.

00:32:41.751 --> 00:32:43.960
I'm overwhelmed, I am anxious.

00:32:43.960 --> 00:32:45.625
I'm having intrusive thoughts.

00:32:45.625 --> 00:32:50.960
Like you brought up, I'm having symptoms of OCD that look different when you just had a baby.

00:32:50.960 --> 00:32:53.007
They don't look like regular OCD.

00:32:53.007 --> 00:32:57.019
It's a specific bubble that you need to be treating.

00:32:57.019 --> 00:32:59.087
It's nothing is set up.

00:32:59.087 --> 00:33:00.492
Nothing is set up for women.

00:33:00.492 --> 00:33:03.804
And then you said the six-week check-in, which Not soon enough.

00:33:03.804 --> 00:33:04.946
That is not soon enough.

00:33:04.946 --> 00:33:08.807
We've gotten through that whole period and now you're gonna check on me.

00:33:09.039 --> 00:33:16.722
So you know who actually provide the best place part of care for my whole dark experience my pediatrician for my, because that falls on them.

00:33:16.722 --> 00:33:17.625
It was so well.

00:33:17.625 --> 00:33:18.446
No, it was so funny.

00:33:18.446 --> 00:33:20.171
So she was actually pregnant.

00:33:20.171 --> 00:33:34.752
I love my pediatrician I refer to everyone, which is probably not a good idea because she has, honestly, she helped me Survive because I was a total disaster when we were going in there because I was actually set up with her to see that first week and if I didn't have her I don't know where I'd be.

00:33:34.752 --> 00:33:34.953
Like.

00:33:34.953 --> 00:33:36.039
I'd be honest with you.

00:33:36.039 --> 00:33:38.990
There were two angels through my whole entire expo three.

00:33:38.990 --> 00:33:39.662
I had my friend.

00:33:39.662 --> 00:33:44.838
That was where my doula as much as she could be with the circumstances that, she just was very there for me.

00:33:44.838 --> 00:33:47.727
That Surgeon that just asked me two simple questions.

00:33:47.727 --> 00:33:49.392
And then my pediatrician.

00:33:49.392 --> 00:33:51.411
She actually did the Edinburgh screening on me.

00:33:51.451 --> 00:33:52.055
Well, they do.

00:33:52.055 --> 00:33:52.818
They're supposed to.

00:33:52.838 --> 00:33:59.833
Now I didn't know that well, she did that on me and yeah, but you know she actually told me this and I really appreciate her saying this.

00:33:59.833 --> 00:34:06.259
Like you know, I had to go to therapy after birth of my first kid because, you know, my husband was in his residency far away.

00:34:06.259 --> 00:34:07.625
I was doing this on my own.

00:34:07.625 --> 00:34:22.972
She had a family member there but she was navigating it and she actually sought out therapy and she told me that, and so that will always stick with me because I do think, as healthcare workers, if vulnerability that's done well, like you don't need to lay down your life fucking story for a patient.

00:34:22.972 --> 00:34:23.481
Don't do that.

00:34:23.481 --> 00:34:24.505
I hate when people do that.

00:34:24.505 --> 00:34:25.269
It's a good thing.

00:34:25.269 --> 00:34:26.675
It was a narcissism too.

00:34:26.675 --> 00:34:29.708
We just like well, let me tell you about how hard it was for me.

00:34:29.708 --> 00:34:36.846
Like no, it's just like you know I get it, like I've been in your shoes and you know that's what I did, so that way you could be like a leader for them.

00:34:36.846 --> 00:34:39.793

Embracing Advocacy: Mary Buffington’s Mission to Improve Maternal Healthcare

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